On The Untamed/Mo Dao Zu Shi

[xparrot]

A couple days ago the sister and I finished watching the cdrama Chen Qing Ling/The Untamed (an adaptation of the danmei (BL) novel Mo Dao Zu Shi/Grandmaster of Demonic Cultivation). This was after we'd watched the first season of the donghua of MDZS and then read the translated novel last autumn, so I'm coming at this story from all sides. So! have a bunch of disorganized thoughts about it.


Overall I really enjoy the story and characters of MDZS, and the main pairing is definitely an OTP of mine; I get sulky at any thought of them broken up. Neither of them quite grab me in a favorite character way but I love both Wei Wuxian for his trickster-with-a-heart-of-gold nature and Lan Wangji for his completely stoic absolute devotion. And I love a lot of the rest of the cast too (though it could definitely do with more ladies), especially Wen Ning (bestest zombie general ever! <3) and the next-generation cultivators.

And the drama's casting is fantastic, almost everyone looks about exactly as I'd picture them. The one exception being Lan Wangji, and to Wang Yibou's credit he pretty much won me over by the end. He doesn't quite have the look -- though that's as much an issue with styling as anything; it was working against the actor rather than with him, I feel (ditto for Lan Xichen). But Wen Ning, Jiang Cheng, Jiang Yanli, all looked their parts perfectly. Also Wen Qing who was just gorgeous, and Jin Ling and Lan Sizhui were such cute little baby cultivators. And for such a young cast the performances were solid -- while I don't think there was anyone as noticeably talented as say Zhu Yilong, there wasn't anyone awful either; it got melodramatic as hell but they all went for it so very sincerely. Wei Wuxian especially -- Xiao Zhan not only has the perfect appearance for the part but he does justice to all of WWX's moods, from cocky trickster to heartbroken kid to the older and wiser man. He's also beautiful though I struggle with how he looks all of fifteen most of the time (he's twenty-seven, which I believe exactly never, just, how?!)

As for how the characters are written -- the drama kind of softens everyone, in part, I suspect, due to Chinese censorship and decency standards -- bad guys have to be bad and good guys have to be good. For some of the characters this was to their advantage. In particular Jin Zixuan, who in the book and the donghua is such a dick that I never fully came around to him. While as in the show he's much more Mr. Darcy -- arrogant but he clearly has a thing for Jiang Yanli and has no idea what to do about it, and the actor channels that adorably. Which of course makes his end all the more tragic.

Also Jiang Cheng is so much squishier and likable in the drama. He's such a mess but you can't help but feel for him (and his actor really sells it -- he's so young but he just throws his whole heart and soul into his crying, aww...)

--Meng Yao might have also been more sympathetic, I have no idea; I hated him so much in the book that I pretty much wanted to punch him from the moment he appeared on screen. I could tell that the actor is objectively good-looking but it couldn't get me over my feelings for the character (and yeah, I'm often a villain fan, but Jin Guangyao just pushes all the wrong buttons for me for some reason. Possibly because I'm so sad for Lan Xichen, who hitched his Lan-horse of loyalty to the wrong wagon, poor thing.)

But I also feel like Wei Wuxian loses his edge a bit, the way his story plays out in the drama. By making Meng Yao more directly responsible for what happens, it mitigates the worst of Wei Wuxian's sins, but it also undercuts his genius and skills. E.g. in the novel, when Jin Zixuan and Jin Zixun are killed, no one takes control of Wen Ning; WWX just loses control. Likewise having the Wens be practicing some kind of demonic cultivation makes WWX using it against them seem more justified, but it also makes WWX developing the demononic techniques seem less special. In the book it's clear that all the evil-summoning talismans and things were WWX's own inventions, as is the stygian tiger seal; the show mentions this but it doesn't seem like such a big deal when the Wens are already raising zombie armies and playing with magic ores and whatnot.

WWX's personality in the novel and in the donghua adaptation seem sharper; in the show he plays the prankster sometimes but it's more obviously an act? He mostly wears his heart on his sleeve. While as in the other versions he often comes across like he doesn't care -- either about other people or about what they think, which makes it that much more affecting, the times when it becomes clear how deeply he does care. And his genius is also more emphasized (the opening of the novel, when he figures out the deal with the wish-granting goddess, is flubbed in both the drama and the donghua but it's such good deducting!)

The drama also has some major pacing issues. There were whole episodes that almost put me to sleep, with endless amounts of talking in circles and reactions without any real plot progression. Some of this is just cdrama pacing and some I am sure was because I knew where the story was going; it was probably more interesting when you were waiting to find out. But I feel like a lot of it could've been cut down or shot/edited to be more engaging. I think the show would've been better served by being 40 episodes, not taking out any scenes, just trimming them. A lot of the action scenes, too, were confusing and hard to follow (like, WWX and LWJ escaping Lanling Carp Tower after Jin Ling stabs WWX is just baffling, why is everyone just standing there watching, why does no one move? And at the very end, when Jiang Cheng flashes back to how he deliberately let himself get caught by the Wens to save WWX -- is it even clear there what happened? I don't think I'd have understood that bit if I hadn't read it already in the book?)

I also didn't really like all the flashbacks being told together in one chunk -- I like the present-time story more than the tragedy of the past, and while the novel can get confusing with all its flashbacks, I preferred that story being broken up. The donghua so far seems to have found a happy medium, with combining some of the flashbacks into a continuous narrative but still returning to the present.

Then, the drama's climax -- I was wondering all along how that was going to play out, given in the book the plot and final villain confrontation is hilariously, gloriously derailed by WWX making the worst-timed love confession in the history of anything and LWJ joyfully going along with it. It's total crack and I adore it.

And I can see why the drama didn't go that way -- even if it had been allowed to make the m/m romance canon, the mood of the show was different enough that it wouldn't really have been appropriate or satisfying.

But at the same time I think the climax getting played straight (eheh...) loses something. It shifts the character focus -- this is supposed to be WWX's story, but he doesn't really do much in the end; it becomes all about Meng Yao and Lan Xichen and Nie Huaisang. In the novel that story is really a backdrop to WWX and LWJ finally figuring things out. WWX realizing that love is the climax of his arc; for all its elaborate plot, MDZS is a romance story.

While as The Untamed drama couldn't be that -- but it definitely did its best to imply it. The end is beautiful, I think perfect for what the series is. ...I mean, I'm a little doubtful that Lan Wangji would actually let Wei Wuxian go off for that long without him that he actually could get a change of clothes, like, how is Lan Zhan going to get anything done as Chief Cultivator when he's just spending all his time fretting about what Wei Wuxian is up to and trying (and failing) to not send out spies to keep him informed? But it showed enough. (and the myriad different ways all these danmei adaptations have walked the subtext line is worth an essay in itself...)

And while Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji didn't get a kiss or even a hug -- Lan Wangji did get to hold him for a good long time! There's a lot of lovely h/c throughout; might as well call him Wei Whumpxian. LWJ and Wen Ning talking in the boat while WWX is unconscious in LWJ's arms is one of my favorite scenes in the book and the drama both, that was beautiful.

...Though I confess, all of this makes me so bitter as a Guardian fan, because WeiLan* could have had that holding! And they could've had a happy ending -- The Untamed proved that a danmei-adapted drama can get away with that much, and I'm so sad that Guardian didn't try. And that it didn't have more of a budget (or better dubbing! or anything!)

* It does crack me up that "WeiLan" could be a ship name for Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji too...and they're definitely pairings cut from the same cloth, the repressed eternally devoted badass with the irreverently confident genius trouble-maker. Lan Zhan and Shen Wei would definitely have a lot to talk about/commiserate over if they went out for drinks (for the five seconds before they both fell over unconscious and their husbands came to drag their drunk asses home...)

In conclusion -- The Untamed is worth checking out if you're in the mood for Chinese fantasy featuring the world's fluffiest necromancer and melodrama and an m/m love story that hovers in subtext just a hairline under the actual text; and if you did enjoy the drama I definitely recommend both the novel and the donghua -- the former has a decent English translation that's actually finished, and the latter is lavishly and epically animated (and ongoing, so no one knows yet how far it's going to go with the relationship...)

Comments

[isweedan]

I like your thoughts and agree with so much of what you said! <333

[qikiqtarjuaq]

Re: Styling on the show - I feel like the actors who looked good in them did so in spite of the styling rather than because of it. For such a high-budget show that put so much effort into the set and costumes, it's a bit baffling how badly the styling was done. At least for the guys. The women were simply gorgeous. They got that part right at least.

Ex:

Xiao Xingchen vs Yan Dafu - Same Actor. Look at the difference!


I mean, he doesn't look bad on the left, but look at his off-the-charts prettiness potential!

Acting - I think I'm in the minority that finds the acting overall really inconsistent. Some really amazing scenes, and some that make me cringe right out of my skin. But for a bunch of rookies with practically no experience, it's a lot better than it could have been!

Wei Wuxian - I think the biggest thing that makes me still more fannish about the books than the show is the fact that Wei Wuxian basically got all of his flaws smoothed out. It's not as satisfying a tragedy if he basically did nothing wrong and still got the ending that he did. His whole downfall leading to the Nightless City massacre is such a huge part of what gives him complexity and makes you go "Oh noooo."

Though I confess, all of this makes me so bitter as a Guardian fan, because WeiLan* could have had that holding! And they could've had a happy ending

I think about what could have beens a lot, because it was rumored before the bankruptcy that Guardian had budget on-par with Nirvana in Fire. /sigh But honestly now I look at all the low-budget stuff, and just find it charming? But yeah, without money or influence it wasn't going to happen. Even completely discounting the money angle, MXTX and The Untamed simply had stronger backers involved if my gossip mongering friends are right.

[xparrot]

I'm just glad my thoughts made some kind of sense, I'm all over the place here! ^^

[xparrot]

Ahhh you're so right about the styling! (wow that pic though...) They had such pretty people that they could overcome it a lot of the time, but yeah...

Acting-wise I never found the cringe-factor as high as, say, some of Guardian's guest stars. The dubbers maybe gave it more consistency? And it also didn't have the contrast, like, in Guardian, Zhu Yilong and Bai Yu literally make everyone else look bad! (it's maybe even more obvious with Bai Yu because he does more interacting with other characters and Zhao Yunlan is just so much more natural and believable...) There weren't any scenes/performances that jumped out at me as being worse...though I admit I found some of the more OTT crying scenes just a little much in everything...

(The music, now, was wildly inconsistent, sometimes it was great and sometimes it was ???!???)

YES to Wei Wuxian's flaws being smoothed out. Hubris as a heroic downfall is so satisfying and the book does a good job of keeping him sympathetic while still having so much blood on his hands. I was wondering if some of it isn't just the demands of cdrama morality but also because of his story? In the novel he literally dies and is reborn, so he's sort of cleared of his sins in that rebirth; while as in the drama he's...resurrected? Or healed? (I was guessing they were limited in how much necromancy they were allowed to show considering they kept insisting Wen Ning was still alive, no really, ignore the black zombie veins??)

Even completely discounting the money angle, MXTX and The Untamed simply had stronger backers involved if my gossip mongering friends are right.

Oooh you mentioned this before on Twitter, do you have more deets? Is it speculation of why they risked giving the m/m a happy ending?

--And yeah, with Guardian, a big-budget version would've been amazing but I find the low-budget charming. Though it makes it a harder sell to some people who don't enjoy camp as much. But I'm mostly just wishing for a happier end...also holding!! Why couldn't Zhao Yunlan have been fully cradling Shen Wei in his arms in 38? ;_; (it's funny because in Untamed, the subtext implies that they're in love but don't actually get together until post-show for all the touching they have before, while in Guardian I'm convinced they're having sex by ep 15 or so but there's so little actual physical intimacy between them...)

[qikiqtarjuaq]

Ahhh you're so right about the styling! (wow that pic though...)

Right? I was blown away by his beauty in 少年江湖物語. It's the difference between "yeah, pretty" vs "breath-taking" and you can really see it in the lighting, make-up and hairstyle.

Acting-wise I never found the cringe-factor as high as, say, some of Guardian's guest stars.

Haha, yeah, don't remind me. At least the extras have the excuse of being dragged in from the filming crew. And woof, Chu Shuzhi's acting. To be honest, if we evaluate it by acting standards in a web drama (that didn't somehow hit the magical jackpot with Bai Yu & Zhu Yilong), the Untamed does pretty well all things considered. I always have to remind myself to adjust my standards vs watching a show like Orphan Black for another example of brilliant acting. I've been spoiled!

Hubris as a heroic downfall is so satisfying and the book does a good job of keeping him sympathetic while still having so much blood on his hands.

All of this is why I adore him as a protagonist. I have no idea what the drama did with his re-birth, but yeah, I think it would have pushed things too far to have WWX the same as he was in the novel. Even Guardian eventually got censored more for violence and Ye Zun's controversial opinions on society than they did for the gay romance.

Wen Ning was still alive, no really, ignore the black zombie veins??

He just became more goth okay. (One change I think I did like is having Wen Ning actually emote instead of having literal facial paralysis due to being a corpse. Cutest zombie ever.)

Oooh you mentioned this before on Twitter, do you have more deets?

I'll DM you!

Why couldn't Zhao Yunlan have been fully cradling Shen Wei in his arms in 38?

Yeah, one of the things I noticed while doing the body language gifspams is that while they do have small, subtle touches and only going as far as shoulder holding - the majority of their intensity comes when they're so so close they're almost touching and you can practically feel the electricity in the air while they stare at each other. It's a very different kind of chemistry, I feel? In a lot of ways more sexual than the Untamed? Not that they lack in the love/devotion department. While the Untamed had a lot more overt romantic gestures and holding.

Or maybe all this is because of Bai Yu's noodle arms, who knows. Apparently, we missed out on Lan Wangji carrying Wei Wuxian in a princess carry because Wang Yibo was too weak. Ditto for Nirvana in Fire. We missed out on Prince Jing carrying Mei Changsu to bed because Wang Kai couldn't lift Hu Ge. I feel like these instances justify the use of wires/supporting special effects, but apparently *I'm* not in charge of c-drama resources.

[xparrot]

At least the extras have the excuse of being dragged in from the filming crew. And woof, Chu Shuzhi's acting.

Ahahahah you mean Lao Chu curling up in fetal position on the floor wasn't the height of classic stagecraft?!
--Though yeah, even putting aside Guardian, going between Untamed and Nirvana in Fire can cause a bit of whiplash...

Even Guardian eventually got censored more for violence and Ye Zun's controversial opinions on society than they did for the gay romance.

Really, given that Ye Zun got censored, I'm surprised Meng Yao could get by? Maybe it's okay because he didn't get to walk off forgiven into the afterlife...?

It's a very different kind of chemistry, I feel? In a lot of ways more sexual than the Untamed? Not that they lack in the love/devotion department. While the Untamed had a lot more overt romantic gestures and holding.

Guardian is some kind of master class in sexual tension that's technically not explicitly sexual. You could do a whole unit on lollipops alone! And yeah, in Untamed there's no doubt of how deep their love goes, but there's less of that sense that they want to devour each other whenever they look at each other. (not sure how much of that is acting vs direction and filming choices. I kind of feel like Untamed was shot to be more 'these guys are beautiful' (even with the styling issues) while Guardian was more shot as 'these guys are hot.')

I feel like these instances justify the use of wires/supporting special effects, but apparently *I'm* not in charge of c-drama resources.

YES...I heard about both these rumors of noodle arms and it's so tragic! ...Though also tragic that Shen Wei never had to princess-carry Zhao Yunlan when we know for sure that Zhu Yilong could've done so to BY without breaking a sweat...! Come on, cater to our carrying needs here...

[qikiqtarjuaq]

Ahahahah you mean Lao Chu curling up in fetal position on the floor wasn't the height of classic stagecraft?!

What really gets me is the "Noooo!" (28:13). So so many things wrong with every single acting choice in that scene.

Really, given that Ye Zun got censored, I'm surprised Meng Yao could get by? Maybe it's okay because he didn't get to walk off forgiven into the afterlife...?

Well, Meng Yao's issues were really with the cultivation world and the major sects, right? I think having this fantasy veneer helps, as opposed to Ye Zun, whose issues are with modern society and its law enforcement/government.

And yeah, in Untamed there's no doubt of how deep their love goes, but there's less of that sense that they want to devour each other whenever they look at each other.

Did you see that behind-the-scenes clip of the director yelling at Xiao Zhan to act more intimate with Wang Yibo while in the boat? And then XZ got so embarrassed, haha, poor puppy. But I think generally with historical dramas, you'll get less overt sexual tension and more pretty people in pretty robes walking amongst flowers, same as it was in Nirvana in Fire compared to the Disguiser.

Though also tragic that Shen Wei never had to princess-carry Zhao Yunlan when we know for sure that Zhu Yilong could've done so to BY without breaking a sweat

Right?! The one guy who demonstrated his ability to princess carry his co-star effortlessly! And with Zhao Yunlan fainting all over the place due to the Hallows too! *sighs*

[anotherslashfan]

I agree with a lot of the points you've made; though my only real quibble is the softening of Wei Wuxian and the lack of actual zombies and ghosts (as opposed to "puppets" and whatever they want to call the black smoke that WWX summons...).
And yes, Wang Yibo does his best but he really doesn't gel with how I imagined LWJ to be. Especially because he really looks incredibly young. To my eyes, Xiao Zhan, on the other hand, doesn't look that distressingly young.
While I agree that the pacing and acting of the drama could have been better, I actually like most of the plot changes, with the caveat that I haven't seen much of the donghua because I noped out in ep 2 or so (WWX really didn't work for me there). I think they did a decent job of preserving scenes that are important to the fans of the novel, and with the whole danmei part diminished, we at least get around to avoid all of the I'm only gay for you parts that I personally dislike a lot. And I was surprised at how prominent the Meng Yao/ Lan Xichen relationship is in the drama...

[anotherslashfan]

Did you see that behind-the-scenes clip of the director yelling at Xiao Zhan to act more intimate with Wang Yibo while in the boat? And then XZ got so embarrassed, haha, poor puppy. But I think generally with historical dramas, you'll get less overt sexual tension and more pretty people in pretty robes walking amongst flowers, same as it was in Nirvana in Fire compared to the Disguiser.

This.

[clevermanka]

Between you, bonibaru, and well, most of the people I follow in the Guardian fandom, I'm SUPER tempted to see this...after I finish my Guardian re-watch.

[xparrot]

Wang Yibou looks his age, yes -- though Xiao Zhan looks younger to me, half the time! And it works for the past stuff anyway, they're supposed to be under 20 then anyway, right? But yeah, he doesn't really fit my mental image of Lan Wangji. It works better with the generally squishier nature of all the chars, though.

I like some of the plot changes -- am definitely glad the women got a larger role, I wish they'd expanded that even more! The other things, like softening WWX, I get why they did it, though I wish they hadn't. Overall the writing was pretty solid, though; my bigger issues were with the pacing, which is more direction/editing than the writing.

[xparrot]

You should, it's very enjoyable! Personally I like Guardian more, though I can't in honesty say Guardian is a better show...just better for me! But really if you like WeiLan it's very likely you'll like Wangxian ^^

[clevermanka]

Between it sounding like a happy(ish) ending and that gifset I saw on Tumblr a few days ago with some character (not sure who, not one of the two main pretty dudes) whining about how terrible his life was I'm pretty sold.

[xparrot]

What really gets me is the "Noooo!" (28:13). So so many things wrong with every single acting choice in that scene.

FLAPPY ARMS OF GRIEEEEF!!

But I think generally with historical dramas, you'll get less overt sexual tension and more pretty people in pretty robes walking amongst flowers, same as it was in Nirvana in Fire compared to the Disguiser.

Ah yeah that makes sense! I haven't seen that many historical things but it tracks with those I have seen. (Wuxia now can be sexier, at least if Bordertown Prodigal was any indication...)

[xparrot]

Yes, happy ending for sure! ...for the main ship anyway, uhhh, I advise you not to get too attached to anyone else? ^^;;;

[clevermanka]

I don't get attached to any characters since the Joss Whedon style of storytelling became la mode (also I spoil myself for literally everything these days).

[qikiqtarjuaq]

Yeah, there's a lot of "walking in on people bathing/cultivating naked" and "people losing their clothes during battle" tropes in wuxia hahaha. And to be fair, we got like, at least one bathing scene in The Untamed, right?

Bordertown Prodigal is... special even for wuxia. Apparently none of it was even in the source material? Someone probably just took one look at Zhu Yilong and decided to turn the show into a BDSM fantasy.

[xparrot]

Apparently none of it was even in the source material? Someone probably just took one look at Zhu Yilong and decided to turn the show into a BDSM fantasy.

I. I mean, who can really blame them?

Now I'm picturing Long-ge, who has of course read the book, going, "But I don't remember Fu Hongxue getting drugged and tied up here...or here...or here?"

And the director *sweating profusely* Oh, oh yeah, you must have been reading the 3rd ed, it was totally in the earlier version...

(thank you, BTP producers!)

[qikiqtarjuaq]

And whose idea was it to have him in different states of agony, writhing around on the bed while FHX gets taken advantage of by various women?

I have to say that show really suited Zhu Yilong's strong suits in crying, looking pretty while chained up, and spitting blood though.

[anotherslashfan]

am definitely glad the women got a larger role, I wish they'd expanded that even more!

I wholeheartedly agree!

And yes, most of the changes are understandable considering censorship restraints, but that won't help explain away the pacing issues. Though I sometimes wonder how much extra scenes were filmed and then discarded...

[demitas]

I agree with a whole lot of this! I enjoyed the novel but the show really made me fannish about the property, and I'm looking forward to going back and reading the novel and being able to picture everything a little better. I've been struggling with cnovels a bit in that I feel like they are a bit more emotionally distant than I'm used to, and I'm not sure if it's because a) different culture b) translation difficulties c) I'm used to fic, which always amps up the emotions to 11. So the drama helped my connect to the characters in a way I struggled with while reading through the first time.

My first time through the novel I got SO ANNOYED at the flashbacks interrupting the present-day plot, and it would always take awhile to mentally shift into flashback mode, so I didn't mind the flashbacks happening all in a row in the series, haha. But I do wish they hadn't needed to soften him for the censors - I like his edges in the novel a lot.

I didn't like JGY in the novel at all until that last line about "I never even thought of harming you". I latched onto tragic LXC/JGY really early in the drama because I knew how that train wreck ended (and also they went hard with the shipping for those two in the drama!)

A scene I wanted a lot but knew I probably wouldn't get: WWX covering LWJ's ears for him so he didn't have to listen to Jiang Cheng scraping his swords together. And as a musician, I really, really wanted them to do something more subtle with blending in the corrupted melodies with the real ones, so it actually sounded like they were playing incorrect notes instead of a completely different song.

[xparrot]

I've been enjoying the cnovels I read, but I know what you mean about the emotional distance, and I've been unsure myself how much is translation vs cultural differences vs yeah, fanfic is its own genre! For me MDZS's story + the donghua got me very attached to the Wanxian, but the drama did make me care more about some of the side chars (...mostly the ones who wind up dead, siiiigh!)

JGY I am just...grrrrrrrr! He's an effective villain for me in that I want to see him defeated, but I just can't like him. To be honest I think the drama playing up the LXC/JGY made that worse for me, because LXC deserves so much better, and if he's anything like his brother he's not going to be able to get over that and move on (and how could he ever again trust someone enough to love them anyway, after that?! Poor LXC! ;_;)

And as a musician, I really, really wanted them to do something more subtle with blending in the corrupted melodies with the real ones, so it actually sounded like they were playing incorrect notes instead of a completely different song.

Yeah, going into a minor key was kind of a giveaway that it was evil! Though at the same time subtle changes would be hard for many people (such as my musically ungifted self!) to hear unless the song was really familiar...would have been neat if they'd managed to pull it off, though! (and yes I wanted WWX in LWJ's lap for the climax, even if it wouldn't have fit the mood!)

[demitas]

I think it killed me most when LXC was like "Yes, that's the same song, but didn't you play it wrong?" IT WAS NOT THE SAME SONG. I'm sure the composer and the screenwriters had no interaction, but ouch I wish there had been some collaboration there.

JGY I am just...grrrrrrrr! He's an effective villain for me in that I want to see him defeated, but I just can't like him. To be honest I think the drama playing up the LXC/JGY made that worse for me, because LXC deserves so much better, and if he's anything like his brother he's not going to be able to get over that and move on (and how could he ever again trust someone enough to love them anyway, after that?! Poor LXC! ;_;)

Oh no, JGY is terrible, I don't like him, and LXC absolutely deserves better. But for some reason this show has me all aboard the angst train (in Guardian I want 90% fluff; I'm not sure why MDZS has done this to me 🤷‍♀️). I eeped a little when you mentioned he's never going to be able to trust anyone again, because I hadn't thought about that, but it's so true and now I get to add that to the angst bank! Poor LXC, indeed. 😭

[xparrot]

As far as music went I was thrown off by how mismatched it was to what the actors were playing -- like, I know that's hard, and it's not like I know that much about flute-playing, but still when WWX's fingers aren't moving in time with the melody at all, it's distracting!

MDZS has glorious angst potential for sure! And yeah, just, LXC understood the evidence against JGY, and chose to believe in him anyway, same as LWJ chose to believe in WWX...but LXC was wrong, and I don't know how after that he'll be able to trust his heart again ;______;

[demitas]

I had to stop looking at their fingers when they were playing, lol. And occasionally WWX's mouth because he wouldn't breathe at the right times. The music itself is beautiful and I love the soundtrack, though!

[drelfina]

(Hi a random person who had been googling Lan Wangji's actor vs Zhu Yilong...)

I agree with everyhting you said! I think that there was so much "WE ARE NOT GAY" in this drama because of the need to avoid the censors that everyone ELSE was amped up to 11 in terms of the homoeroticism.

I might have screamed so much about Xue Yang and Xiao Xichen, becuase holy FUCK was that part already heart-breaking and heart-wrenching in the novel, and now it's even worse in the drama, because the XY actor really amped up the obsessive crazy stalker behaviour, especially with the way he was cleaning XXC's body and then made a meal for him afterwards? I was actually rooting for XXC to wake up even though I knew how fucked up this pairing would be?!

And LXC... god. like i swear if they had just made both the Lan bros into girls, this would have made a huge heartbreaking wuxia subplot - i mean it's typical isn't it? For the Bad Guy to ask "will you die with me" and then when LXC put his hand down... LGY shoved him back while staring longingly at him in that - distant - gonna die for you now.

Because all he wanted was SOMEONE to love him back???? or something??? I can't believe I actually am shipping these two terrible ships, where both LXC and XXC are such purehearted people who got tragically taken advantage...

and only LWJ and WWX's story worked out...

(And of course I then went and watched Guardian and I was sdjfsdjkfsdf at the production value and writing but the two Shen Wei and Zhao Yunlan? daaamn. I did want Zhu Yilong to be Lan Wangji after seeing him act - i felt like Lan Wangji didn't quite have the presence with that actor but ...hnnng)