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xparrotI haven't seen the last couple eps of SV, am building up strength with the delight of new Who to be able to bear them. I have, however, read ep commentaries, so there may be spoilers in this post, and do not worry about spoiling me. I can't be spoiled for this show; the writers already spoiled it seasons ago. This isn't really about the latest canon events, though; this is to finally articulate a long-standing argument, concerning the entire run of the show.
I've seen the following opinion expressed many times in this fandom, often when questioning Lex's s1-3 Room o' Clark or the Lex-apologist view that if Clark had been a bit more honest much disaster may have been averted:
Only as I see it - Clark's childhood friends had a right to know, too. It drives me up a wall how the show justifies all manners of lies and trickery and worse for the sake protecting Clark's secret. Because the thing is - it's not Clark's secret.
In the original Superman canon, Clark Kent's secret identity is his own to maintain or share as he sees fit. Those who try to ferret out the truth are unethically prying into his personal affairs; his identity is his own business, as is the truth about his origins, Krypton, etc.
Butt SV's kryptonite makes it a lot of other peoples'. The kryptonite isn't limited to hurting Clark; it poisons all of Smallville. Krypton's destruction isn't only Clark's tragedy. Everyone who had their lives altered or destroyed by those damn plot rocks, directly or as a victim of a meteor freak, deserves to know what they are, where they came from. And yes, that includes Lex, budding supervillain or not.
What the show and Clex fans alike tend to gloss over is that Lex's original investigation wasn't into Clark - it was into the accident. Lex should have died, and didn't, and is understandably curious. And just as Clark has a right not to tell people the truth about his own life - so Lex has the right to look into the truths of his own life. That those truths happen to be bound up in Clark's is an unfortunate coincidence for both of them.
This isn't to say Clark owed Lex all his secrets. But Clark's right to not say anything does not invalidate Lex's right to keep looking. Especially once he became aware of the extent of what he was investigating. Once he realized his physiology, his own body, might have been compromised by his childhood exposure to the meteor shower; once he realized how many other people in Smallville were similarly afflicted.
In season 1, Lex explicitly is not investigating Clark Kent's secrets - he warns Nixon away from the Kents. He's after the secret of the whole town, and while he realizes the Kents are involved, he has no way of knowing they're at the center. He wasn't prying into Clark's life because Clark was his friend; Lex would've been investigating them even if he had no friendship with Clark, and probably would've found the truth a lot sooner. (If Lex had made friends with Clark only because he realized Clark was at the nexus of Smallville's enigma, that would've been pretty dastardly. But the show repeatedly made the point in the early seasons that Lex's relationship with Clark was much deeper and more complex than that.) And Clark never sets actual boundaries - he repeatedly attempts to steer Lex away from his investigation, but never asks Lex outright to stop it, for the sake of friendship or anything else. Lex brings him rumors of a spaceship, and Clark tells him he's crazy - doesn't ask him to leave it be. Lex sinks a lot into saving the caves, gives Clark access, and Clark denies they have any significance to him, doesn't tell Lex to stop looking into them.
Even in season 3, with Lex's CoCK (Chamber of Clark Kent) - there's a reason the set designers included those enormous, baffling shots of Clark Kent hanging on the wall, and that is to distract from that fact that most of the stuff in the room a) does not directly relate to Clark, but to kryptonite and other leavings of Krypton; and b) mostly is within Lex's legal and, arguably, moral right to possess. He bought the land with the caves, so the pictures of the cave paintings and the alien parasite are legally his; the kryptonite is likely all taken from LuthorCorp properties in Smallville (and thank goodness someone is cleaning some of it up; it's an incredibly dangerous health hazard, which the government really should've disposed of years before.) The car from the wreck was Lex's own car. As shocking as Clark found the room, it wasn't nearly as terrible a betrayal as the show seems to intend it as, and besides after openly lying to Lex for three years Clark hardly had the moral high ground.
But Clark's not really to blame here. In the first few seasons he was a minor anyway and his parents had the legal power to make the decisions about his secrets (including whether or not to tell Clark himself, and they sure took their time about that, even. Question for legal experts, because I honestly have no idea - does an adopted child have any legal right to investigate his birth parents? Even if those parents don't want to be found? Just wondering...) They also made sure to brainwash him into thinking that any investigation into his secrets was terrible and dangerous - and, moreover, that he had the right, even the responsibility, to stop anyone who tried. Including people trying to figure out what is ruining their own lives, because the Kents chose to define Clark's secrets as not only Clark himself, but absolutely anything to do with his planet of origin.
They weren't being illogical; any investigation into the kryptonite had a good chance of leading to Clark sooner or later. But it was a very morally gray choice to make, to deny an entire community the truth, when people were getting hurt and dying of it. The Kents knew from early season one that kryptonite was mutating people, and they chose to say nothing, to pretend ignorance and let Clark have the burden of responsibility for taking care of the problem. It's a lot to put on a teen's shoulders - even a super-powered teen's - and maybe it's not surprising that Clark is now so hesitant to assume the mantle of vigilante hero, when it was a role forced on him from so young.
The Kents were honestly doing what they thought was best for their beloved son. Sure, they could've anonymously informed the town council that the meteor rocks were a threat, or campaigned to get them cleaned up for any number of reasons that wouldn't require any mention of Clark; sure, they could've claimed Clark was another meteor freak and sponsored the support programs for understanding and accepting meteor freak-i-tude. At the very least they could've trusted their close friends with a little bit of vital, possibly life-saving information, perhaps told them to move - or moved themselves (raising Clark in a meteor-rich environment seems like some sort of neglect, really). But they didn't, out of fear of losing their adopted child; they put Clark's future ahead of the entire town's.
It doesn't really bother me that they did so; such is a parent's love. What gets me is that the show never makes an issue of their choice, never implies that, however understandable and well-meaning, it was hardly the absolute right decision. And Clark, now that he's growing up, keeps making that same decision again and again, protecting his secret at great cost to strangers and friends alike, and never once is questioned or called on it. Except by Lex, who is always cast as the villain - not only for all the truly reprehensible, evil things he's been doing - but also (sometimes primarily) for having the temerity to want to know the truth about his own self, his own home and his own childhood. This is clearest in "Memoria," when Lex seeking to study his own memories is presented as an unforgivable trespass against Clark, for which Lex must apologize; but it happens repeatedly throughout the course of the series.
The only times Clark really pays for protecting his secrets is when it comes to Lana, who keeps breaking up with him over them - and, all right, given her all-encompassing importance to him, that's probably is about the worst punishment he could get; but it hardly seems fair, compared to what so many meteor freaks suffer (untimely death, more often than not; or else commitment to mental hospitals ill-equipped to handle their problems. For many 'freaks, 33.1 is actually their best bet.) There's no programs for the meteor-afflicted, no research being done on the condition except in Lex's horrifically unregulated secret labs, because Clark and his cabal will do anything to shut down any open, above-board investigation. Even when his own friends are looking into it, he'll steer them away from the truth--Lex isn't his friend anymore, but Clark hasn't been anymore forthright with Lois. Or for that matter, Kara, when she had lost her memories, and guess what, even by Kent rules, it was Kara's secret, too. (As far as I'm concerned, not telling amnesiac Kara, far more than keeping things from Lex, was a terrible betrayal on Clark's part. I didn't understand it at all - it's not like it would've been difficult to convince her, even if she was powerless at the time; just bend a steel bar in front of her, for pity's sake. I'm sure she would've come around.) But Clark's secret-keeping is out of control; he doesn't know how to share his secret, only how to protect it. No flight and capes indeed - Justice and the American Way are arguable, but Truth is right out.
Would Clark being honest with Lex have changed anything? Impossible to say. Whether Clark had a moral obligation to tell Lex - and everyone else - at least some of his secrets is an open question, and practically moot at this point. Letting Lex in on the truth now would probably be a mistake - SV!Lex is insane by now (and not in JLU!Lex's awesomely sociopathic way.) I don't hold Clark responsible for Lex's crimes, but I can't really see fit to hold Lex responsible, either. He needs to be committed before he hurts more people; however manipulative he tries to be, he doesn't seem to be in control of anything, including his own life or decisions. I've given up on justifying most of what he does, because they're the actions of a terriblywritten deranged man. But I'll still agree with every time he accuses Clark of the treachery of keeping his secrets, because someone needs to make that too true point, even if it's the bad guy.
I've seen the following opinion expressed many times in this fandom, often when questioning Lex's s1-3 Room o' Clark or the Lex-apologist view that if Clark had been a bit more honest much disaster may have been averted:
I've always wondered why so many thought that Clark owes Lex his secret. Lex was a new friend, someone he was just getting to know, what entitled him to know Clark's secret when friends he had since childhood didn't know it?
Only as I see it - Clark's childhood friends had a right to know, too. It drives me up a wall how the show justifies all manners of lies and trickery and worse for the sake protecting Clark's secret. Because the thing is - it's not Clark's secret.
In the original Superman canon, Clark Kent's secret identity is his own to maintain or share as he sees fit. Those who try to ferret out the truth are unethically prying into his personal affairs; his identity is his own business, as is the truth about his origins, Krypton, etc.
Butt SV's kryptonite makes it a lot of other peoples'. The kryptonite isn't limited to hurting Clark; it poisons all of Smallville. Krypton's destruction isn't only Clark's tragedy. Everyone who had their lives altered or destroyed by those damn plot rocks, directly or as a victim of a meteor freak, deserves to know what they are, where they came from. And yes, that includes Lex, budding supervillain or not.
What the show and Clex fans alike tend to gloss over is that Lex's original investigation wasn't into Clark - it was into the accident. Lex should have died, and didn't, and is understandably curious. And just as Clark has a right not to tell people the truth about his own life - so Lex has the right to look into the truths of his own life. That those truths happen to be bound up in Clark's is an unfortunate coincidence for both of them.
This isn't to say Clark owed Lex all his secrets. But Clark's right to not say anything does not invalidate Lex's right to keep looking. Especially once he became aware of the extent of what he was investigating. Once he realized his physiology, his own body, might have been compromised by his childhood exposure to the meteor shower; once he realized how many other people in Smallville were similarly afflicted.
In season 1, Lex explicitly is not investigating Clark Kent's secrets - he warns Nixon away from the Kents. He's after the secret of the whole town, and while he realizes the Kents are involved, he has no way of knowing they're at the center. He wasn't prying into Clark's life because Clark was his friend; Lex would've been investigating them even if he had no friendship with Clark, and probably would've found the truth a lot sooner. (If Lex had made friends with Clark only because he realized Clark was at the nexus of Smallville's enigma, that would've been pretty dastardly. But the show repeatedly made the point in the early seasons that Lex's relationship with Clark was much deeper and more complex than that.) And Clark never sets actual boundaries - he repeatedly attempts to steer Lex away from his investigation, but never asks Lex outright to stop it, for the sake of friendship or anything else. Lex brings him rumors of a spaceship, and Clark tells him he's crazy - doesn't ask him to leave it be. Lex sinks a lot into saving the caves, gives Clark access, and Clark denies they have any significance to him, doesn't tell Lex to stop looking into them.
Even in season 3, with Lex's CoCK (Chamber of Clark Kent) - there's a reason the set designers included those enormous, baffling shots of Clark Kent hanging on the wall, and that is to distract from that fact that most of the stuff in the room a) does not directly relate to Clark, but to kryptonite and other leavings of Krypton; and b) mostly is within Lex's legal and, arguably, moral right to possess. He bought the land with the caves, so the pictures of the cave paintings and the alien parasite are legally his; the kryptonite is likely all taken from LuthorCorp properties in Smallville (and thank goodness someone is cleaning some of it up; it's an incredibly dangerous health hazard, which the government really should've disposed of years before.) The car from the wreck was Lex's own car. As shocking as Clark found the room, it wasn't nearly as terrible a betrayal as the show seems to intend it as, and besides after openly lying to Lex for three years Clark hardly had the moral high ground.
But Clark's not really to blame here. In the first few seasons he was a minor anyway and his parents had the legal power to make the decisions about his secrets (including whether or not to tell Clark himself, and they sure took their time about that, even. Question for legal experts, because I honestly have no idea - does an adopted child have any legal right to investigate his birth parents? Even if those parents don't want to be found? Just wondering...) They also made sure to brainwash him into thinking that any investigation into his secrets was terrible and dangerous - and, moreover, that he had the right, even the responsibility, to stop anyone who tried. Including people trying to figure out what is ruining their own lives, because the Kents chose to define Clark's secrets as not only Clark himself, but absolutely anything to do with his planet of origin.
They weren't being illogical; any investigation into the kryptonite had a good chance of leading to Clark sooner or later. But it was a very morally gray choice to make, to deny an entire community the truth, when people were getting hurt and dying of it. The Kents knew from early season one that kryptonite was mutating people, and they chose to say nothing, to pretend ignorance and let Clark have the burden of responsibility for taking care of the problem. It's a lot to put on a teen's shoulders - even a super-powered teen's - and maybe it's not surprising that Clark is now so hesitant to assume the mantle of vigilante hero, when it was a role forced on him from so young.
The Kents were honestly doing what they thought was best for their beloved son. Sure, they could've anonymously informed the town council that the meteor rocks were a threat, or campaigned to get them cleaned up for any number of reasons that wouldn't require any mention of Clark; sure, they could've claimed Clark was another meteor freak and sponsored the support programs for understanding and accepting meteor freak-i-tude. At the very least they could've trusted their close friends with a little bit of vital, possibly life-saving information, perhaps told them to move - or moved themselves (raising Clark in a meteor-rich environment seems like some sort of neglect, really). But they didn't, out of fear of losing their adopted child; they put Clark's future ahead of the entire town's.
It doesn't really bother me that they did so; such is a parent's love. What gets me is that the show never makes an issue of their choice, never implies that, however understandable and well-meaning, it was hardly the absolute right decision. And Clark, now that he's growing up, keeps making that same decision again and again, protecting his secret at great cost to strangers and friends alike, and never once is questioned or called on it. Except by Lex, who is always cast as the villain - not only for all the truly reprehensible, evil things he's been doing - but also (sometimes primarily) for having the temerity to want to know the truth about his own self, his own home and his own childhood. This is clearest in "Memoria," when Lex seeking to study his own memories is presented as an unforgivable trespass against Clark, for which Lex must apologize; but it happens repeatedly throughout the course of the series.
The only times Clark really pays for protecting his secrets is when it comes to Lana, who keeps breaking up with him over them - and, all right, given her all-encompassing importance to him, that's probably is about the worst punishment he could get; but it hardly seems fair, compared to what so many meteor freaks suffer (untimely death, more often than not; or else commitment to mental hospitals ill-equipped to handle their problems. For many 'freaks, 33.1 is actually their best bet.) There's no programs for the meteor-afflicted, no research being done on the condition except in Lex's horrifically unregulated secret labs, because Clark and his cabal will do anything to shut down any open, above-board investigation. Even when his own friends are looking into it, he'll steer them away from the truth--Lex isn't his friend anymore, but Clark hasn't been anymore forthright with Lois. Or for that matter, Kara, when she had lost her memories, and guess what, even by Kent rules, it was Kara's secret, too. (As far as I'm concerned, not telling amnesiac Kara, far more than keeping things from Lex, was a terrible betrayal on Clark's part. I didn't understand it at all - it's not like it would've been difficult to convince her, even if she was powerless at the time; just bend a steel bar in front of her, for pity's sake. I'm sure she would've come around.) But Clark's secret-keeping is out of control; he doesn't know how to share his secret, only how to protect it. No flight and capes indeed - Justice and the American Way are arguable, but Truth is right out.
Would Clark being honest with Lex have changed anything? Impossible to say. Whether Clark had a moral obligation to tell Lex - and everyone else - at least some of his secrets is an open question, and practically moot at this point. Letting Lex in on the truth now would probably be a mistake - SV!Lex is insane by now (and not in JLU!Lex's awesomely sociopathic way.) I don't hold Clark responsible for Lex's crimes, but I can't really see fit to hold Lex responsible, either. He needs to be committed before he hurts more people; however manipulative he tries to be, he doesn't seem to be in control of anything, including his own life or decisions. I've given up on justifying most of what he does, because they're the actions of a terribly
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Date: 2008-04-18 11:47 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-18 02:41 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-18 11:54 am (UTC)you're right about the questionable morality of the kents having pretended ignorance about the meteor rocks, given what they were doing to people around town. the kents disappointed me over and over with their screwy morals and the way they conditioned clark to be secretive and suspicious. ("did anyone see you? were you careless with your 'gifts'?") that conditioning is likely one reason he's not developing very fast into a superhero.
i like everything you say about lex and his investigations. it has seemed to me that the whole show has been geared toward driving lex insane. sometimes the cruelty of it has hurt me, just watching it. (so has the cruelty of the way everyone lays guilt on clark. i won't go into lana and how she's treated him.)
sorry about all the words. i meant just to tell you i liked what you had to say, but now i've spouted off. oops!
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Date: 2008-04-18 02:45 pm (UTC)Clark, meanwhile, yeah, he baffles me. Superhero secret identities I've always found highly suspect anyway - vigilante justice is a dangerous thing - but that Clark can do anything in the name of protecting his secret, no matter how many innocents are hurt because of it - that's not heroic.
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Date: 2008-04-18 01:27 pm (UTC)My problem is that it's like the powers that be couldn't figure out how to make Lex be EVIL - choose to be "evil" - with how they started so they just drove him crazy, sure he's high functioning-ish, but events and people calling into question his sanity for wanting to understand, oh I don't know being the vessel for the head of an alien invasion, seems to have conspired to just push Lex off his rocker. And I know that the whole Lil!Lex fire thing towards the end of last night episode was supposed to be code for the death of Lex's conscious, but for me it just came off as one more piece of Lex's crazy.
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Date: 2008-04-18 02:48 pm (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2008-04-18 02:29 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-18 02:52 pm (UTC)And it's still Kara's secret anyway. Keeping her own life story from her was just wrong.
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Date: 2008-04-18 03:32 pm (UTC)However, there were other, and are other, things going on in Smallville that directly relate to Lex and things that have happened to Lex; those things - attacks by meteor mutants, alien attacks, vessel for Zod - that while related to Clark's secret are not mainly concerned with Clark's secret and deflecting Lex from Clark's part of the secret shouldn't have included calling Lex crazy in the face of manifest evidence to the contrary and in contravention of Lex's own experiences. That would drive anyone crazy, Lex just had more money to throw at the problem.
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Date: 2008-04-18 03:29 pm (UTC)That was actually the point where I found Clark unforgivable, and it's colored my impression of him since then.
Clark knew what memories that Lex wanted back and he didn't want Lex to know them because then Lex would know his secret. Okay, fine sure, it's all about protecting the secret. But Clark doesn't just try to stop him or break the machine or just let it run it's course in the hopes that the treatment will fail. No, he goes to Lionel the man who so wanted to keep his own secret that Clark watched him fry his son's brain. He went to Lionel and it wasn't just protecting his secret anymore. It wasn't passive or a side effect. It was a deliberate and malicious act on his part. He basically cocked the gun and aimed it in Lex's direction, but when Clark got shot instead, he blamed Lex, even though Lex was the one to actually save him. He told Lex that he was becoming more and more like his father even though he'd just displayed every single Lionel trait: no care for other, malicious, and emotionally manipulative.
Un.For.Givable
Or for that matter, Kara, when she had lost her memories, and guess what, even by Kent rules, it was Kara's secret, too. (As far as I'm concerned, not telling amnesiac Kara, far more than keeping things from Lex, was a terrible betrayal on Clark's part.
And it makes no sense either.
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Date: 2008-04-18 03:46 pm (UTC)About all those various aliens bent on carving the Earth up on pieces, well it's great that Clark knew that he had the powers and ostensibly the responsibility to stop them, but you know what NO ONE ELSE knows that Clark is the go to guy. All everyone knows, and yes here I mean Lex more then any one, is that there are dangerous creatures out there destroying things and using random people as hosts - those people have no choice and no say and hey get to be burned up husks when the Zoners are done with them. At this point Lex is not a nice guy fine, but he's not wrong in trying to fight this and figure out what's going on and there had to be a way to keep Clark's secret without pulling the crazy seeing things card, because no, just no.
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Date: 2008-04-19 02:42 pm (UTC)I want someone to explain the Kara thing to me, because I cannot make sense of it. Sometimes when I watch SV I feel vaguely brain-damaged, like, there must be some logical relation between events, but I can't see it!
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Date: 2008-04-18 03:47 pm (UTC)I never thought Clark owed Lex the whole story, but lying the way he did was just dishonorable. The way things were set up, I just can't help but feel that if Clark had just not lied--admitted that Lex saw what he saw but told Lex he couldn't talk about it--Lex would have had at least one person he could count on and perhaps wouldn't be quite so batshit insane.
The Clark/Lex dynamic is so central to the plot that the other relationships get lost in the shuffle, but you're absolutely right that it's a bigger issue. You just don't treat friends and people you supposedly love that way.
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Date: 2008-04-19 02:46 pm (UTC)I don't know why Clark at least couldn't have played dumb(er) with Lex - "Uh, yes, I saw those super-powered aliens and glowing stones, too, what the heck?" Telling Lex it was all his imagination was just giving it away, having no respect for his friend's intelligence or sense.
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Date: 2008-04-18 04:56 pm (UTC)I guess they felt justifiably scared of the way Lex has access to the sources of answers and knows how to ask the right questions, and that he's in the position to actually do something privately and profitably about the information, even without Lionel in the picture. Everyone seemed to have had personal experience (on-screen or vicariously) that the Luthor approach to information is control and manipulation, which is why everyone except Clark so suspicious about Lex's offers. If initially he was essentially afraid of rejection, Clark had become protective of his secret because he's seen how it has caused pain and suffering, so he resorts to avoidance/denial like the rest of Smallville. I don't think he ever considers have deep thoughts on who has the right to know the secret until he's forced to (seems like the pattern until he takes up the cape). Telling Lex to respect his privacy would be the same as acknowledging the existence of a secret, and as long as it's not out in the open, he doesn't have to do anything about it. It's the kind of considerate selfishness that I could understand, but doesn't excuse his moments of being a judgmental punk.
He hasn't learned anything beyond personal responsibility because he let his self-esteem issues, tied up with the skewed sense of obligation to deceive people, prevent him from connecting to others (I don't think he means to be an insensitive prick). He's still mostly reactive to social and kryptonite-related problems, because he hasn't experienced more of the world to find his balance yet. He has since learned how to do more hero stuff, but I don't think he wants decide yet to grow and live a fuller life, content as he is now to live it out in the farm. Maybe he still thinks leaving the farm would mean giving up his small happiness to face the world that might reject him, and he doesn't dare to take the step towards that level of selflessness until he's given reason to. Maybe Lex would end up being the reason?
As for Lex, I've long since accepted that no one cares about his sense of self, intellectual/emotional needs for validation, or sanity, except us fans. But even though it's the fate of supervillain geniuses, I refuse to give up on him, even if Lex himself has already!
Huh, I hope that was coherent. Operating on three hours of sleep here.
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Date: 2008-04-18 06:30 pm (UTC)I try to explain to Clark fans that it's not Clark not telling Lex his Secret that bugs me, it's the fact that he repeatedly tells Lex that he's CRAZY for believing in aliens, spaceships and a possible alien threat when HE'S an alien!
No matter what Lex does (he's the villain, he's supposed to commit heinous crimes), it's CLARK'S despicable acts that disgust me.
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Date: 2008-04-18 06:54 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 02:52 pm (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2008-04-18 07:05 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 02:54 pm (UTC)(Take some comfort in knowing that Lex is still the most likable character in the show. Since he's now a pathetic, psychotic, patricidal moron, that gives you an idea of what trying to fan on it's like these days XP)
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Date: 2008-04-18 07:54 pm (UTC)What the show and Clex fans alike tend to gloss over is that Lex's original investigation wasn't into Clark - it was into the accident. Lex should have died, and didn't, and is understandably curious.
This is one of the things that always annoyed me--Lex really wasn't investigating Clark in the beginning. He just came to a conclusion that put Clark smack in the middle of his investigation. That's not his fault.
The only times Clark really pays for protecting his secrets is when it comes to Lana, who keeps breaking up with him over them - and, all right, given her all-encompassing importance to him, that's probably is about the worst punishment he could get; but it hardly seems fair, compared to what so many meteor freaks suffer (untimely death, more often than not; or else commitment to mental hospitals ill-equipped to handle their problems. For many 'freaks, 33.1 is actually their best bet.)
I have to seriously disagree with this. I think it hurt him to keep lying--to not be able to tell anyone his secret. There were a lot of things he didn't get to do, and taking a look at how liberated and happy he feels whenever he loses his powers, I think it's a stretch to say that the only time Clark pays for having secrets is when he lies to Lana.
Mainly, I disagree with you when you say Clark had an obligation to share his secrets. Sharing a secret like that would have very easily landed him in a lab. I think a lot of people also forget that, at the time when he might still have trusted Lex enough to tell, he was a teenage kid whose parents were drilling him with the importance of secrecy. By the time he'd grown up a little, Lex had, as you've pointed out, become someone whose actions aren't logical or even always sane anymore.
Thanks for posting this. It opens a lot of things up for some good discussion.
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Date: 2008-04-19 03:11 pm (UTC)One of the things that drives me nuts about the show - and drove me to side with Lex, until he went totally batshit - is that from the start it presented all of Lex's investigations as eeeeevil, when orginally they were reasonable and not especially immoral.
I have to seriously disagree with this. I think it hurt him to keep lying--to not be able to tell anyone his secret. There were a lot of things he didn't get to do, and taking a look at how liberated and happy he feels whenever he loses his powers, I think it's a stretch to say that the only time Clark pays for having secrets is when he lies to Lana.
Somewhat a stretch, but most of the prices he paid - not being able to play football, etc - pale in comparison to what the meteor afflicted suffer.
I wasn't intending to argue that Clark had to share *all* his secrets, with Lex or anyone else (though the essay did meander, I might've muddled my point.) Telling folks the truth about his personal alien being is one thing (though I hesitate to agree with the "landed in a lab" conclusion, considering very few of the meteor freaks ended up in labs, at least not until Lex got interested...the government of the SV 'verse is shockingly hands-off, at least before this season! er, where was I?) But Clark & the Kents keep all the secrets of the meteors, when they could've tried to do some good (I went into this more here)
It also gets me that when Clark lies about anything related to his secrets, his morality is rarely questioned; instead it was always presented as if Lex is in the wrong for pursuing his investigations, long before those investigations were hurting anyone.
And yes, I agree that the Kents take a lot of the blame for this, especially during Clark's formative years. But Clark is getting old enough now to make his own decisions, and he's still keeping secrets from his friends (not Lex now, but Lois, and Kara when she was amnesiac) - even if those secrets could get his friends hurt - not telling Lois that meteor mutants are a very real threat is endangering her life!
(not at all, thank you for responding to the post, I love a good friendly debate!)
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Date: 2008-04-19 03:12 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 12:22 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 06:58 am (UTC)I know where you're coming from, but "the secret" really isn't about "Clark is an alien" vs. "plot rocks are dangerous". The way I see it, Clark have every right to keep that little bit of knowledge to himself, because that part of the secret doesn't endanger others (well, until the Kryptonians shows up and starts killing people). What we were shown was that plot rocks has been changing/endangering other people long before Clark knows about them, it was in the news all the time, except other people never seems to put two and two together. Lionel knows about them since he's been playing with them for who knows how long, seriously, secret basements doesn't built themselves over night. Even afterwards, when the elder Kents knows about the danger of the rocks, for both Clark and other people, they still doesn't do anything about it and let a teenage Clark shoulder that burden of stopping the infected people.
And I am sorry but no one can tell me that no one else in that town but Chloe and Kents noticed the effects that the meteorites had on the people in that town. That towns leadership should have made the effort long ago to sweep that town clean of the meteor rocks that was infecting its citizenship.
I think the leaders just choose not to do anything about the meterorites, I don't remember who said it or from which episode (the one with the flowers?), but the pesky rocks apparently puts out low level of radiation that's not harmful to the human body. I don't care how low level the radiation is, SV is covered with them.
Which of course just brings me back to lazy writing, anyway enough rant from me, I think we actually agree on some things, just not how the show should have excuted it.
(no subject)
From:(no subject)
From:(no subject)
From:no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 05:10 am (UTC)Again; too long in that town cuz the show's called 'Smallville' and it's being milked.
I'm not going to get into the whole thing because it just hurts me too much to see the possibilities betrayed...on both sides. I got into this story late last year, and i am glad of it, because it meant i watched from DVDs and got info from LJ and fics and knew when to stop. I quit before it got bad and from there it can be as it should be in my head, and the show can be just another whacky, badly-written AU. And therein i am happy. Because the show has gotten itself into such a boil of interconnected messes with their illogic and lack of attention to continuity/show history that it's as untangleable as the problems of a government. I've heard it put by someone more eloquent than me that it seems the writers got lazy knowing that everyone knows where these characters are supposed to END UP, and so stopped working hard to pay attention to how they SHOULD be getting there, and instead just took all kinds of short cuts and illogical loops with them that make no sense, because it served the story that week.
And it hurts to see these characters betrayed by that kind of disregard. I stick with when they made sense and extrapolate from there. And as i said, i believe i am happier for it.
no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 03:31 pm (UTC)A resounding YES to this. Really, I'd be happy to cheer Clark on, if I felt he deserved it. But even when he does the right thing, it's for the wrong reasons more often than not - and he so rarely does anything I really can see as right. Part of this is personal morality - I have problems with lying ever being presented as the 'right' choice. And everyone in Smallville lies - not just about Clark's secret; that fundamental cover-up seems to inspire everyone to follow suit, so you have things like Martha lying to Jonathan about taking Lionel's campaign money, and Chloe cheerily going along with Lana's bachelorette party even though she thinks Lex is a monster, and it's just - I cannot tell the heroes from the villains; Lex is doing the most horrible things these days, but no one is actually acting heroic. It's like they think if they make Lex look bad enough, Clark will look good...but it doesn't work like that. Especially when your hero's supposed to be SUPERMAN, for pity's sake!
I stick with when they made sense and extrapolate from there. And as i said, i believe i am happier for it.
I hear you! (really, for all my ranting, I usually maintain the Identical series is the true canon, and the show is, as you said, a bad AU... XP)
no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 05:19 am (UTC)Huggles!
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Date: 2008-04-19 03:34 pm (UTC)Turning away was the right choice, I'd say; the show's like an abusive boyfriend, I keep coming back but it always hurts me in the end. Much happier with SGA, really, where I tend to find the plotholes and foibles more charming than obnoxious. (besides, SV, for all it has Lex, suffers from a regrettable lack of Rodney McKay. XP)
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Date: 2008-04-19 05:46 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 03:48 pm (UTC)(no subject)
From:no subject
Date: 2008-04-19 11:10 am (UTC)That said I agree the writers have stuffed up Clark and his denials about things to Lex. Specifically aliens and other things. He should be able to acknowledge stuff even if not admitting involvement or that he helped stop it. Or the like. I hate the needless dishonesty. But I don't expect much improvement from the writers any time soon.
As for the kryptonite not being cleaned up. Also the Kent's not campaigning for it. That's logical. Although I could give the weak defence of them not wanting to put their heads above the parapet to avoid potential trouble for Clark (that's why political office was dumb but again nothing new from the writers). The real reason for the lack of clean up is because of the Freak of the Week format of the show. As they need Clark to face a superpowered being most weeks. If the metoer rocks were cleaned up then they'd have no Freak (unless there was unethical experiments that were done maybe). Which would be a problem for the show. Unless they want constant alien invasions or mad scientists (which also occur but less often). It's a problem "Doctor Who" faced when he was trapped on Earth with the third Doctor. So they make Smallville like Sunnydale in the denial of problem stakes. And your tramatised view of the main character was also a problem in that show (Buffy and "BTVS"). Which I had a problem with. Especially when they took the friendships for granted. I'll admit that's why I liked in season six when he said he appreciated Chloe. I think "Smallville" suffers from various inconsistent writing. But I still can enjoy the relationships even if inconsistent. Whether evil or good. I do wish they'd killed Clark/Lana romantic feelings (but not necessarily friendship) years before as it got tiresome. Sorry I'm wandering. I'll leave it there. I hope you'll forgive my ramble and want to warn you except for ads I haven't seen the seventh season as you can only see it on HD digital TV in Australia legally. I don't have that.
Angeloz
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Date: 2008-04-19 03:58 pm (UTC)That being said, it's totally true that pretty much all of the problems I have with the show, universe, and chars really stem from lazy, inconsistent, bad writing; and, as you say, that's unlikely to change anytime soon. My nitpicking and arguments are actually entertaining for me (...er, yes, I have a strange sense of 'entertaining'!) and are the main reason I watch the show these days. Hey, I think of it as educational - if ever I write for TV, I know what not to do, anyway!
(no subject)
From: (Anonymous) - Date: 2008-04-19 06:17 pm (UTC) - Expandno subject
Date: 2008-10-01 01:24 pm (UTC)I am off work with a crappy cold, so decided to see the world work right and read some fan fiction. And I end up being greatly amused by your rants.
I have not watched season 7 as i having been throwing things at the TV during season 6 and cannot afford a new one if my aim every improves.
I agree so much it is silly. The hang up everyone had with honesty and truth they forget Clark lied before he knew about being an alien and lied badly. All I every want was Clark to say "I can't answer that with out getting other people in trouble." But know that the answer to the questions will always be either a lie or being told it was none of Lex's business
That always bugged me as everything that Lex did was up for public debate, like when he tried to retrieve his memories. I know Clark was protecting himself but privacy has to work both ways.
On who are the good guys. when Oliver Queen claimed to have grown since the instance at boarding school only a few weeks after kidnapping Lex for a vivisection, was not that believable for him not being as selfish as ever.
Your rant about the selfishness of Chloe and Clark in only saving her mother at any cost was good but missed I believe the following points.
1) The treatment at 33.1 worked, got her out of the coma state.
2) Her room had no chains. It was secure room from any decent mental health ward.
3) The first action taken was not take control of Lex and have him order her release it was have innocent people comimt murder. Is this a product of a stable personailty.
Also the tagging, did you ever wonder why on earth Lex would let the cyborg see him or why with all the money he must of cost why he was not tagged? Personal belief, in 10 years Lex will retreive the bug that guy has been carring around and use it to get every one charged for terrorism.
The baby storyline will never make sense, my favorite excuse was Lex found out the baby was Zod's, got it out of Lana to study and choose to let her believe him of the despicable act of faking the pregnancy so she would never look for the child.
Lex had to go insane the character that they wrote was never going to cross the line from some whose morals are different from everyone elses to someone who was actually evil. However in my world I have him going of in a fit the first time he sees the costume and after intense therapy (a year or so)coming back and saying "if you want bad you ain't seen nothing yet".
Well I need more medication and will probably go watch SGA as my supernatural DVD are still out make converts, it was cool ranting with you. Bye
no subject
Date: 2008-10-02 07:28 am (UTC)If you are still in the mood for pro-Lex-ranting, I'd like to point you toward
loyal minionsallies, he's got so few in the show itself!