A not-all-inclusive Keller poll

[xparrot]

Yup, I've got better things I ought to be doing - but I didn't get much sleep last night, so I'm not doing them. So here, have a poll!

I'm seeing a lot of divergent opinions around about Dr. Jennifer Keller 'round SGA fandom these days, and I'm terribly curious about the stats (my apologies to everyone who's heartily sick of this.) As is apparent to anyone who reads my lj regularly, I'm not exactly unbiased about this, but I've tried to make this poll as neutral as possible; please speak up if you think it fails in that.


[Poll #1312661]

Comments

[liviapenn.livejournal.com]

I haven't been watching much of this season, but what annoyed me about Keller in S4 was that her characterization seemed very variable-- like it changed in every episode. What annoys me *now* is that they basically could have done every Keller episode with Katie Brown instead. What was the point in having Rodney break up with Katie Brown if they were just going to have Keller be the exact same type of character, in the exact same type of relationship with Rodney?

Also, if they'd kept Katie around, there wouldn't have been a reason for them to *focus episodes on her*-- and I can't imagine how annoying it is to have multiple episodes in this season focused on a brand new character, when people also know these are the last episodes we're ever gonna get.

And also, w/out Keller, it wouldn't have been so disappointing for the Ronon fans, who got led on thinking that there might be Ronon/Keller, and were really hoping to see Ronon get focused on in that type of storyline, instead of the kind he usually gets.

[busaikko]

I keep making two mental comparisons re characters and relationships:

1. Keller vs Amanda. Amanda's new, right? She's serious, competent, kickboxes, and half of her dialogue is 'yes, sir.' But the way she's been introduced to us is very show-don't-tell, and I find myself liking her (and her little bun!) a lot. Keller, on the other hand, I liked S4, but S5 I feel as if I'm being *told* how great and lovable she is, with no evidence. Gr.

2. McKay/Keller vs McKay/Sheppard. I'm a geek-girl. Keller, as of S3, was written as a geek-girl. So why, for goodness' sake, are they trying to give us dozen-roses, party-dress, girlie romance Keller -- and remaking McKay into someone who digs that? I would totally buy McKeller if we saw Rodney and Jennifer racing cars, or playing video games, or trash-talking DC Comics. If we saw that they could be themselves together, the way McKay is with Sheppard. So (re question 4) I'd be totally behind having more major romance on SGA, if it was the kind of romance I can see the characters having, based on their personalities.

I *swear* sometimes I think one of the writers is in a bitter divorce or a midlife crisis or something ('Torture is nothing compared to marriage!' quoth Sheppard *headdesk*)

[julia-here.livejournal.com]

I disliked Carson (no particular reason, just didn't like him) and loved Jewel on Firefly and was thrilled to see her come to SGA.

You think I would have learned from Ben Browder and Claudia Black, but noooooo.

Julia, alas.

[ezazahaz.livejournal.com]

More detail, even though I totally have other things I need to be doing... :)

On Keller vs Carson:
I liked Carson, but not Carson-centric episodes; I didn't really find this a problem until he came back. I liked Keller okay when she was first introduced, but not once she became more of a main character and there became more Keller-centric (and Rodney/Keller-centric) episodes. Plus, I have a hard time separating my opinion of her from my opinion of Rodney/Keller. (I think mostly I need doctor-types for my h/c, but want them to stay in the infirmary and stop getting entangled in plots and relationships...)

On Rodney/Keller:
I did at one point think it might work, but changed my mind; it's still better in theory than in practice, but now I don't like it in theory either.

On Miscellaneous opinions:
-I loved Jewel Staite, and it makes me sad that Keller is making me not like her much anymore. :(
-My reason for disliking romantic relationships in shows is more that they don't do the pairings I like. I think I could have actually liked Ronon/Keller, if they'd kept with that. (And McShep, as if that would ever happen. :) )
-This season has been a roller coaster of lousy and awesome.
-I'm curious if anyone besides me ticks both the Sad and Relieved options about this being the last season...

[xparrot.livejournal.com]

Apparently a lot of people like Rodney/Keller because it's so different from Rodney/Katie. I admit to not seeing that; Keller is different from Katie (more critical, less eager to please him), but the way Rodney acts around her seems exactly the same to me.

Yeah, I was hoping for some romantic Ronon, shame that didn't work out. I get the feeling most of the writers have Ronon-phobia; they don't know how to handle him...

[xparrot.livejournal.com]

(Your icon = AHAHAHAHA SCARY!)

Yeah, I have this feeling with Amelia that if they'd focused on her much more, I wouldn't like her as much...I really quite like her now, when we've been given a little bit to go on and can extrapolate the rest. With Keller, they're not giving us space for extrapolation, but they're not giving us enough else to like her for, either.

And seriously - as much as I'm a McShepper, if they'd given us geek-girl!Keller playing with Rodney, I might've betrayed my OTP for it. (Heck, if a Sam Carter from another universe turned up wanting to get hot & heavy w/ Rodney, I'd be on that 'ship with bells on; I frickin' loved them together, loved how Rodney could obnoxiously, unabashedly, be himself around Sam.)

The SG-writers' view on romance is downright creepy sometimes. (Really, I'm glad the show won't actually go slash; I have a bad feeling these writers would've ruined McKay/Sheppard for me, if they'd made it canonical...)

(ETA because I think we mean Amelia, not Amanda!)

[wintercreek]

On Rodney/Keller: I liked the way it started - I liked seeing the little hints of their interest for each other and the things they had in common. The writers lost me at The Shrine, though. As someone, somewhere in fandom said: The SGA writers don't understand the advice to "show, not tell" - they're TELLING us that Rodney loves Jennifer, but that episode was all about SHOWING us that Rodney loves John. I'm not a mutually exclusive 'shipper, and I could have dealt with the slow build toward a Rodney/Jennifer canon while maintaining my McShep happy place ... but this business of hamhandedly shoving Rodney/Jennifer at the audience doesn't work for me.

Also, I'm sad for Ronon. He's been flirty (arguably and depending on whether one watches the show with slash goggles) with Elizabeth, Teyla, John, Jennifer, and no one has worked out for him. How about some Ronon lovin'?

To ezazahaz: I ticked both Sad and Relieved. Closed canon is more comfortable for me, especially when the writing can be erratic like it is on this show.

[xparrot.livejournal.com]

I know - I was so excited to have Jewel on! (And I actually liked Farscape:SG-1, even...) Now I kind of feel sorry for her, she deserves better material than this...

[eleveninches.livejournal.com]

In full disclosure: I don't watch either Stargate show for the romance, so I'm not 100% happy with having romantic relationships in the eps. That said, I like Keller, and Rodney/Keller is cute, so, you know, whatever. I'm a slasher; I don't particularly need (or necessarily desire!) my pairings to be canon. So as long as a canon pairing isn't the entire focus of the show, I'm cool with it.

[xparrot.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of doctor-types as main characters, I prefer them as background h/c supporters myself. (I've got some theories why this is so - their compassion being part of their job makes it hard to tell how close friends they really are with other characters - but it could just be the way SG writes them...)

I honestly am happy the show never would do canon McShep, I've got a terrible feeling they'd spoil it for me! XP

I ticked both sad & relived myself! It's how I feel...

[julia-here.livejournal.com]

The young lady can act, and she can deal with technical jargon and look as if she knows how to use wrenches; when she took off her boot to wrap a twisted ankle in "Missing" the utter first-aid fail was the fault of the people behind the camera, and it was the moment they lost me.

Julia, it's so easy to get the little details right, and they don't even bother with that, no wonder they think we can buy Jennifer's nagging as "unconditional love"

Keller

[hawtboyluvin.livejournal.com]

I loath Keller!
I don't hate her case she replaced Carson
She is in my opinion a bad doctor!

Rodney is an amazing person who SHOULD NOT be changed or told what to do by this person!
Rodney has more Chemistry with a shoe..than he does with Keller!

Keller is loved by TPTB so much that the other characters have suffered in light of TPTB infatuation of Staite/Keller.. including Rodney who was unceremoniously paired up with Keller!

These are my opinions of course..not to be changed! For this is how I feel!

[ivadel.livejournal.com]

My only problem with Keller is that I don't believe her. I don't believe her as the head of medicine - I don't believe her as a surgeon. She is just too young - physically and mentally.

[gblvr.livejournal.com]

I thought the first go 'round with McKay and Keller, in 'The Last Man', was handled well -- there was a build-up to their relationship, and it didn't feel forced.

This time, though, it was less show and more 'let's cram it down people's throats', which I hate under any circumstances...I'm not even sure why we're supposed to believe they even like each other, let alone the basis of their love.

[auburnnothenna.livejournal.com]

I honestly may just dislike doctor characters, since I disliked Carson Beckett too, and if I stretch to consider SG-1 too, I'm not too fond of Lam. - If they were going to bring someone back from the dead couldn't it have been Janet instead?

I like Jewel Staite, I liked Kaylee, I just don't like the Keller character, and so I can't like her with Rodney. Yes, I like McShep, but I could have enjoyed Elizabeth and Rodney together (she knew exactly who and what he was and appreciated the good with the bad, she didn't try to change him, and she could manage him), Sam and Rodney (again, she sees him clearly and could stand up to him without needing to change him), or to get vaguely crossover-ish and strange Kaylee and Rodney (anyone who could work on a ship with Mal and Jayne could deal with Rodney and she'd have appreciated his brilliance under pressure).

So, it's Keller, the character, I dislike. And that makes me dislike McKay/Keller, because you never want to see someone you like with someone you think doesn't deserve them.


And I answered that I was sad to see the end of the show (I am, even when it makes me mad or disappoints me or goes another direction than what I like, I'll still miss seeing new episodes), but at the same time, I do feel a little that if it's going to be the McKay Keller show, well, I won't miss that so much. I'd rather it end before the disappointments turn to dislike.

[gaffsie.livejournal.com]

I didn't mind Keller when she was first introduced. I really hated Carson's guts (and he is still my least favourite SGA character) and thought that she was a decent replacement, thinking that she would be a supporting character, like Carson should have been. It was when the focus of the show suddenly shifted to her that I started disliking her. Part of it is resentment for stealing the spotlight from characters I actually care about, part of it is the way all the other characters are fawning over her, but I also do find her genuinely annoying. She is just so whiny, and Rodney and her brings out the worst in each other.

And then there's the romance. Why don't you just gag me with a spoon. If I wanted to watch shoddily written romance, I'd be subscribing to the Lifetime channel.

[sheafrotherdon.livejournal.com]

I didn't see the idea of Rodney and Keller coming, so I can't say (a la the poll question) that I liked the idea or disliked the idea before it happened, because I just wasn't there. In principle, I don't hate the idea at all, but I do feel (as others have said) that I needed more groundwork to embrace them as folks in love - the great 'show, not tell.'

Here's where I stand on the whole shebang. There is much in canon SGA that I do not like: Carson; Elizabeth spending most of her Atlantis life standing on the control-room balcony; the whole end of season two / beginning of season three arc; the race issues; the gender issues; the sexuality issues (despite my read of everyone as potentially gay, the whole thing is very hetero-normative, even in terms of the planets they visit); the terrible episode with the war crimes trial; the inconsistent characterization; the sense that the writers are often making things up as they go.

Yet equally, there is so much that I love - the idea of big damn heroes; the banter; the Team love; the whales; the crazy last minute fixes; the fact that no one's left behind; the way Sam looked in leather pants; the remote-controlled car races; Michael; Todd; the very idea of Atlantis and Pegasus and all that could be out there; the Jumpers; the ATA gene; the way that John is 12.

And so I take what I love and I write solutions to what I don't, and I think of Keller in the same way. I loved her in S4, like her less in S5, and I want better for her than she's getting. I want better for them *all* than they're getting, for the Team, for the secondary characters, and perhaps most of all for the Pegasans who are usually medieval backdrop instead of primary, world-building superstars. I want Rodney to go back to earth and sneer at Bill Nye; I want John to laugh until his belly hurts; I want Teyla and Kanaan to find enormous happiness; I want Ronon to get laid, geez, it's been ten years! I want all of them to be as intelligent and flawed and curious as they can be, and for Jennifer to embrace living in a whole other galaxy, however stressful the responsibility that comes with that. I want every one of them to be loved and to give love, and to use their big old brains and their skills and their tactical know how, and for not one of them to walk onto a degrading Hive ship and forget that it's made of organic material so huh, how about that?

Half the fun of being in fandom is in filling in the blanks and imagining more than it's possible to imagine for a show constrained by censors, studios, 42 minutes of run time, and a set budget. I think Keller's getting the short end of the stick, just as so much else does on our show, and I can't wait to write it different. Annnnnd . . . here endeth my moment on the soapbox :D

[yellowvalley.livejournal.com]

WORD on this. Exactly.

There might be one major difference

[alyburns.livejournal.com]

What annoys me *now* is that they basically could have done every Keller episode with Katie Brown instead. What was the point in having Rodney break up with Katie Brown if they were just going to have Keller be the exact same type of character, in the exact same type of relationship with Rodney?

The ages of the two actresses probably accounts for it. Good heavens, we simply can NOT allow a 40 year old man to actually date - let alone end up with - a woman in her thirties! The world would end. I'm sure it's written in the Great Book of TV Irritations that 40 year old geeks "...shall end up with pretty, cute as button girls in their twenties!"

::gags::

[shaddyr]

when she took off her boot to wrap a twisted ankle in "Missing" the utter first-aid fail was the fault of the people behind the camera, and it was the moment they lost me.

OMG YES!

I remember watching that and spluttering in my tea, squawking, "NO NO NO! She's a DOCTOR fer gossake! She KNOWS better n' that!" I mean come ON! I only have my basic First aid ticket, and *I* know better than that!

I thought I was the only one.

[busaikko]

Heh: but mixing up names is canon! (It was a Rodney-trait, now it's a Woolsey-trait *g*)

[katikat.livejournal.com]

I never cared much for Beckett, I liked him but he wasn't my favorite person ever and I didn't mind when they killed him off. But compared to Jennifer, he had personality. He was a Scotsman, he talked with an accent, he hated Ancient technology, he loved fishing... Jennifer is, I don't know, either she's bland or a total Mary Sue, there's no consistency. And sorry, I just don't see her as the medical chief of Atlantis, she's too "/o\, what do I doooooooo?" to be that.

And her relationship with Rodney? Uh, it feels like incest since they are more like brother and sister, I don't see any sparks there. He's also too old for her, or at least it feels that way with him being all acerbic and her all shy and inexperienced, so whenever I see them together, it's like craddle-robbing. And when did they actually fall in love? There was like one scene with them, then nothing, then one scene again and suddenly it's a big epic love. It feels... weird, as if their romance was cut down to a reader's digest's version.

[dragonladyk.livejournal.com]

You forgot the "She's the Devil! The Devil, I say! Douse her in gasoliine and light her on fire, the diabolical Mary Sue object of TPTB's fratboy lust! The foul Bella Swan of Science fiction!" option, because that's closer to what I actually feel about her.

Why am I releived this is the last season? No more Magical Mystery Mary Keller with her half-assed written whining and sucking up screentime that could be better spent on anything else, including Teyla standing alone in a dark room reading the collected works of Athosian wisdom.

Brain Storm was only saved from the rubbish bin by the unfathomable awesomeness of Bill Nye the Science Guy. He was so awesome that I still loved the ep even with the McKeller bullshit and Keller acting like she was Rodney's goddamned mother.

With the sole exception of Bella Swan in "Twilight," I have never hated a fictional person as much as I hate Keller.

This is very sad, since I liked her better than Carson in "Adrift," "Lifeline," and "Doppleganger." Then they WRECKED HER, and SMASHED HER AWESOMENESS INTO TINY, TINY MISOGYINISTIC PIECES.

DragonLady

[xparrot.livejournal.com]

Yeah, the lack of "show, not tell" seems to be killer for a lot of fans. And poor Ronon! How can a guy that gorgeous not get the girl (guy) at least once?!

[dragonladyk.livejournal.com]

See, I'm not for the canon shipping and I slash Ronon like a slashy gayboy thing, but Ronon/Amelia Banks (that's her name)? I could get behind that in a heartbeat because Banks is cooler in 20 minutes than Keller has been in two seasons.

It's all about presentation. ~.^

DragonLady